Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

discuss emulators of 26-bit acorn systems e.g. arculator and rpcemu
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Nick_B
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Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by Nick_B »

I’m trying to install Arculator v2.1, having previously got v0.99 working using the pinned installation instructions.

As I couldn't find any instructions for later versions, I decided to follow the v0.99 instructions again and adapt where necessary. For example, I noticed that the “ArculFS” folder has been renamed to “HostFS” in v2.1 so I adjusted accordingly, but the HDD doesn’t seem to configure correctly.

I assume I must be doing something wrong because I've tried the same approach with v2.0 and I get the same issue. In all three cases I've used the blank formatted 50Mb HD image from the Arculator download web-page.

Anyway, I’ve attached a sequence of pics to illustrate the issue, and I'd appreciate any help or advice.

The first pic is an excerpt from the v0.99 instructions detailing the initial system commands:

Pic #1.jpg

The next pic shows my commands:

Pic #2.jpg

I then perform a reset:

Pic #3.jpg

At this point, according to the instructions I should see:

Pic #4.jpg

But in my installation, the HDD doesn't seem to be configured correctly:

Pic #5.jpg

And if I try to access drive 4, I get the following error message:

Pic #6.jpg

As an Archimedes and RISC OS newbie I've probably overlooked something, so any help or advice would be much appreciated.

Cheers,
Nick
Sophira
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Re: Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by Sophira »

As you noted, those install instructions are very out of date. They were written before a number of very major changes in how Arculator works, particularly the fact that Arculator now uses a configuration manager.

The reason you're having problems with the hard disc, for example, is because the process of using the disk image has changed. It used to be that you would rename the disc image to "hd4.hdf" as per those instructions and it would pick it up, but nowadays you don't do that; instead, you use the configuration manager that pops up when you start Arculator to point to the correct disk image to use.

I'll see if I can get more up-to-date instructions written up, but generally the recommended move nowadays if you just want to use RISC OS is not to use the hard disc image at all, but to use HostFS instead. Back when it was called ArculFS it was a lot more limited than it is today, but nowadays using HostFS is virtually indistinguishable from using an emulated hard disc, and it's a lot easier to work with. (It's also very slightly faster.)

I would advise the following commands:

Code: Select all

*Configure IDEDiscs 0
*Configure FileSystem HostFS
After a reset, that'll remove the ":4" icon from the icon bar. After that, just use the HostFS icon as your normal hard drive; everything you put there will also be accessible via your host filing system in the "FS" directory.
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IanJeffray
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Re: Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by IanJeffray »

Maybe also worth noting the latest Arculator is presently 2.2, not 2.1 : http://b-em.bbcmicro.com/arculator/
Nick_B
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Re: Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by Nick_B »

Sophira wrote: Tue Dec 05, 2023 2:11 pm The reason you're having problems with the hard disc, for example, is because the process of using the disk image has changed. It used to be that you would rename the disc image to "hd4.hdf" as per those instructions and it would pick it up, but nowadays you don't do that; instead, you use the configuration manager that pops up when you start Arculator to point to the correct disk image to use.
Thanks Sophira, I should have said that I did try to load “HD4.HDF” as “Drive :4” using the configuration manager, but I got the same result, so presumably I’m not doing it correctly.

I realise that I could use HostFS as the HDD, but I would also like to learn/understand how to configure IDEDisk4 correctly in v2.0 onwards, so any help to achieve that would be very much appreciated.

Cheers,
Nick
Nick_B
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Re: Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by Nick_B »

IanJeffray wrote: Tue Dec 05, 2023 2:23 pm Maybe also worth noting the latest Arculator is presently 2.2, not 2.1 : http://b-em.bbcmicro.com/arculator/
Thanks Ian, I am aware, but Norton decided to quarantine the v2.2 files :roll: because (I think) it hasn’t yet received/recorded enough feedback that the associated files are safe, so I switched to v2.1 as a temporary workaround.

Cheers,
Nick
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IanJeffray
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Re: Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by IanJeffray »

Nick_B wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2023 9:18 am
IanJeffray wrote: Tue Dec 05, 2023 2:23 pm Maybe also worth noting the latest Arculator is presently 2.2, not 2.1 : http://b-em.bbcmicro.com/arculator/
Thanks Ian, I am aware, but Norton decided to quarantine the v2.2 files :roll: because (I think) it hasn’t yet received/recorded enough feedback that the associated files are safe, so I switched to v2.1 as a temporary workaround.
Boggle. Just take it out of quarantine : https://support.norton.com/sp/en/us/hom ... s/v6200305
Nick_B
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Re: Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by Nick_B »

IanJeffray wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2023 9:37 am Boggle. Just take it out of quarantine : https://support.norton.com/sp/en/us/hom ... s/v6200305
Thanks for the link - I’d planned to do that after checking out v2.1, but I got sidetracked with the configuration issue.

Cheers,
Nick
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SKS1
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Re: Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by SKS1 »

Nick_B wrote: Tue Dec 05, 2023 11:36 am I’m trying to install Arculator v2.1, having previously got v0.99 working using the pinned installation instructions.

As I couldn't find any instructions for later versions, I decided to follow the v0.99 instructions again and adapt where necessary. For example, I noticed that the “ArculFS” folder has been renamed to “HostFS” in v2.1 so I adjusted accordingly, but the HDD doesn’t seem to configure correctly.

I assume I must be doing something wrong because I've tried the same approach with v2.0 and I get the same issue. In all three cases I've used the blank formatted 50Mb HD image from the Arculator download web-page.
Have just tried with the HDF from the Arculator page on a v2.2 install, and it just works on an emulated A5000. Which Archimedes system have you configured for emulation? Might it expect ST-506 drives? If I use a copy of that same HDF with an emulated A440/1 (and ST-506) then I have to use HForm for the drive to be usable.
Miserable old curmudgeon who still likes a bit of an ARM wrestle now and then. Pi 4, 3, ARMX6, SA Risc PC, A540, A440
Sophira
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Re: Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by Sophira »

Nick_B wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2023 9:02 am Thanks Sophira, I should have said that I did try to load “HD4.HDF” as “Drive :4” using the configuration manager, but I got the same result, so presumably I’m not doing it correctly.

I realise that I could use HostFS as the HDD, but I would also like to learn/understand how to configure IDEDisk4 correctly in v2.0 onwards, so any help to achieve that would be very much appreciated.
Fair enough! In that case, the first thing you'll want to check is that you're using a new enough machine type. In the machine dropdown you'll need to select any machine from the A5000 onwards for the built-in IDE disc to work (with the exception of the "A500 (prototype)" entry). If you want to use an earlier machine, it's still possible to get a hard disc image working but you'll need to do a little more work - specifically, you'll need to use a SCSI (AKA31/AKA32) or ST506 (AKD52) podule, and you'll need to format the drive yourself. If you're using such a machine, let me know and I can guide you through it.

Otherwise, the next thing is to check the image you're using. If you're using the blank 50MB disc image that the instructions suggest downloading, you should be good to carry on as this image is already formatted for use with the built-in IDE disc setting. Otherwise, you'll need to format it yourself in RISC OS (including if you used the "New" button to create your own image in Arculator), and also the process of using a custom disc image will differ depending on the size of the image (images that are 64MB or less are easier to work with; otherwise you'll need to use a podule as above). Again, let me know if that's the case, and I can guide you.

Otherwise, if you're using the downloadable blank 50MB image and you're already using a newer machine, then that's a little odd - it should mostly Just Work, and the blank 50MB disk image that's available to download is already formatted for use with IDE. Just in case, though, here's the correct procedure for attaching the image:

1. Open Arculator, click once on the configuration you want to change, then click the Configure button (the one with the hammer and spanner on it).
2. Go to the second tab with the image of a hard disc on it.
3. Within the upper half (the "Drive :4" section), click the "..." button to open up a file browser.
4. Find the HD4.HDF file you downloaded, and double-click it.
5. It'll ask you to confirm the hard disc parameters of the image. For the downloaded 50MB image, it should have automatically picked the right values, which are:

Sectors: 32
Heads: 8
Cylinders: 795
Size (MB): 49

6. Click OK, and then click OK again to close the configuration window.
7. Double-click on the machine to boot it up.
8. Once booted into the desktop, press F12 and enter these commands (you don't need to worry about upper-case here, entering all lower-case is fine, and you can omit the starting * on each line if you like):

Code: Select all

*Configure IDEDiscs 1
*Configure FileSystem ADFS
*Configure Drive 4
9. Press ENTER again to return to the desktop, then use the menu to hard reset the machine.
10. Upon returning to the desktop, you should see an "IDEDisc4" icon on the icon bar.

Hopefully this post helps - if you have any further questions, or need more guidance, I'm happy to help however I can.

[edit: I meant to type "64MB or less", not "less than 64MB" - sorry! I've fixed that now.]
Nick_B
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Re: Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by Nick_B »

Sophira wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2023 10:24 am
Fair enough! In that case, the first thing you'll want to check is that you're using a new enough machine type. In the machine dropdown you'll need to select any machine from the A5000 onwards for the built-in IDE disc to work (with the exception of the "A500 (prototype)" entry). If you want to use an earlier machine, it's still possible to get a hard disc image working but you'll need to do a little more work - specifically, you'll need to use a SCSI (AKA31/AKA32) or ST506 (AKD52) podule, and you'll need to format the drive yourself. If you're using such a machine, let me know and I can guide you through it.

Otherwise, the next thing is to check the image you're using. If you're using the blank 50MB disc image that the instructions suggest downloading, you should be good to carry on as this image is already formatted for use with the built-in IDE disc setting. Otherwise, you'll need to format it yourself in RISC OS (including if you used the "New" button to create your own image in Arculator), and also the process of using a custom disc image will differ depending on the size of the image (images that are 64MB or less are easier to work with; otherwise you'll need to use a podule as above). Again, let me know if that's the case, and I can guide you.

Otherwise, if you're using the downloadable blank 50MB image and you're already using a newer machine, then that's a little odd - it should mostly Just Work, and the blank 50MB disk image that's available to download is already formatted for use with IDE. Just in case, though, here's the correct procedure for attaching the image:

1. Open Arculator, click once on the configuration you want to change, then click the Configure button (the one with the hammer and spanner on it).
2. Go to the second tab with the image of a hard disc on it.
3. Within the upper half (the "Drive :4" section), click the "..." button to open up a file browser.
4. Find the HD4.HDF file you downloaded, and double-click it.
5. It'll ask you to confirm the hard disc parameters of the image. For the downloaded 50MB image, it should have automatically picked the right values, which are:

Sectors: 32
Heads: 8
Cylinders: 795
Size (MB): 49

6. Click OK, and then click OK again to close the configuration window.
7. Double-click on the machine to boot it up.
8. Once booted into the desktop, press F12 and enter these commands (you don't need to worry about upper-case here, entering all lower-case is fine, and you can omit the starting * on each line if you like):

Code: Select all

*Configure IDEDiscs 1
*Configure FileSystem ADFS
*Configure Drive 4
9. Press ENTER again to return to the desktop, then use the menu to hard reset the machine.
10. Upon returning to the desktop, you should see an "IDEDisc4" icon on the icon bar.

Hopefully this post helps - if you have any further questions, or need more guidance, I'm happy to help however I can.

[edit: I meant to type "64MB or less", not "less than 64MB" - sorry! I've fixed that now.]
Thank you so much for that Sophira!

I had been configuring the machine as A5000, and using the blank 50MB blank image.

I don’t know what I was doing wrong but it’s working now, although the automatically populated HD parameters differ from those you specified as follows, with my parameters in brackets:

Sectors: 32 (63)
Heads: 8 (16)
Cylinders: 795 (100)

Amending the parameters to the values you specified gave a 99MB size, which didn’t seem right so I went with the automatically populated values.

Thanks again for your help!

Cheers,
Nick
Nick_B
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Re: Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by Nick_B »

SKS1 wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2023 10:00 am Have just tried with the HDF from the Arculator page on a v2.2 install, and it just works on an emulated A5000. Which Archimedes system have you configured for emulation? Might it expect ST-506 drives? If I use a copy of that same HDF with an emulated A440/1 (and ST-506) then I have to use HForm for the drive to be usable.
Thanks you for taking time to test this.

I had also been configuring the machine as A5000, and using the blank 50MB blank image.

I don’t know what I was doing wrong, but by following the instructions Sophira provided it’s working now with v2.1 too.

Thanks again.

Cheers,
Nick
Sophira
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Re: Arculator 2.1 - Help needed please

Post by Sophira »

I think Arculator has some weird glitches with the hard disc parameters sometimes. I copied the values I gave you from the window I was seeing, but now that I try it again I'm replicating what you saw where those values give 99 MB instead of 49 MB like I saw before, and loading the image up does give me the 63/16/100 values you get now too. My apologies for giving you potentially incorrect values!

I should probably report this as a bug.
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