the Night Owl BBS

[brianmartin_2001]

Late start but Night Owl host is up for
the evening.

Was busy unpacking my ModelB from its trip away
It now has Econet.

Much fun awaits.

[brianmartin_2001]

Early today.

BBS host is waiting for calls.

Also added a Guest login for those who just want
a browse to see what it is like. Hopefully this might help
reduce the bot numbers.

Name GUEST
Surname GUEST
p/w NIGHTOWL

Cheers

[brianmartin_2001]

The Night Owl BBS Host is open for the evening.

cheers
Brian

[brianmartin_2001]

Host up for this evening ..

All welcome

Brian

[brianmartin_2001]

Host is now up this Tuesday evening..

Call tonight , leave a message.

Cheers
Brian

[brianmartin_2001]

Sorry I didn't open the Host yesterday evening.
I was playing with my new two station Econet.
Pi Bridge link to my two machines is working well
(I think) although I've got lots to read up on.

I didn't get a single call the previous three days so
I figured traffic would be zero again like it has been ..
Must be the bright nights arriving.

Hopefully some calls this evening .. Night Owl BBS may end
up a weekend only thing if the lack of traffic continues.

cheers !

[brianmartin_2001]

Night Owl Host now up for the evening ..

One caller last night (thanks Neil), and someone (a bot?) who
tried to log on as anything (ABC DEF). There is a Guest account
for that now . Absolutely everyone is welcome to log in and browse
around just don't want a headache with lots of frivolous accounts
to delete ( the host software can't actually delete them completely ,
it just deactivates them so I just have to reuse them
with editing when I can).

3 New ART frames added to the Gallery ( last few frames).
70's, 80's album covers

cheers

[brianmartin_2001]

Night Owl Host now up for the evening ..

One caller last night (thanks Neil), and someone (a bot?) who
tried to log on as anything (ABC DEF). There is a Guest account
for that now . Absolutely everyone is welcome to log in and browse
around just don't want a headache with lots of frivolous accounts
to delete ( the host software can't actually delete them completely ,
it just deactivates them so I just have to reuse them
with editing when I can).

3 New ART frames added to the Gallery ( last few frames).
70's, 80's album covers

cheers

[davidb]

One caller last night (thanks Neil), and someone (a bot?) who
tried to log on as anything (ABC DEF).

That was me trying to log in via the web interface that someone had set up. It just doesn't seem to get further than the login screen, so I gave up.

[brianmartin_2001]

Hi David ,

Unfortunately I forced you off as you were trying to get
on with an impromptu user and password.
I have lots of fake unused accounts I can't get rid of.
I tried to inform you to use the guest account
by typing in on the login screen , maybe you didn't see
the message

Both web links work fine.

You are more than welcome to return
and browse.

Just login with a sensible name or handle
and password. Thanks.

I ll be logging up the host quite soon.

Cheers
Brian

[brianmartin_2001]

Night Owl Host now up for the evening ..

cheers

[brianmartin_2001]

Night Owl BBS is up early ..Sunday 5 th

Cheers

[brianmartin_2001]

The Night Owl host is waiting for calls.

All welcome , cheers

Brian

[trixster]

Visited the BBS tonight - what a great site! Loads to read and look at as well as live chat with Brian. I'll definitely be back.

[brianmartin_2001]

Great to have you visit Andy, pleased you enjoyed your
look around.

Night Owl is now up for the evening.

[brianmartin_2001]

Someone is trying to access (3 times now, Leeds area) the board and seems to be having some issues getting on.

Please drop me a line on here or PM if you need any help.

[brianmartin_2001]

Night Owl Host now up for this evening.

Wed 8th

Cheers

[brianmartin_2001]

Night Owl Host now up

Call tonight , say hello

Cheers

Brian

[brianmartin_2001]

BBS Host now up for Friday evening !

cheers

[brianmartin_2001]

Host is up for any visitors who aren't
overwhelmed by the aurora this evening.

It's Real, Retro, Viewdata ! you will connect to
an original BBC Master 128.

Message Boards
CET Downloads section
Viewdata ART
YouTube channel recommendations
BEEBFAX
Interviews
Retro Micro History section
Sysop Blog
Sysop Chat,

Plenty to browse through if you haven't done so in a while
or if ever.

How to Connect

TCP
nightowlbbs.ddns.net:6400 (2400 BAUD)

or
web browser

http://fish.ccl4.org/js-nightowl/

https://vd-view.azurewebsites.net/

Dialup available via TELSTAR and the Cutel gateway

7E1 1200 baud (V23 ONLY).

Cutel 02034228439.

TELSTAR 01756664433


cheers
Brian

[brianmartin_2001]

Night Owl Host is on an early start today .

Pop in and say hello..
cheers
Brian

update - I think someone was having trouble again getting
input at the Login screen. I think they were using the
Vd-view web link to the Board.

This link doesn't appear to be working at all just now.
I can't even bring it up on my browser.

Use the js-nightowl link for now, thanks.

I have contacted Simon L about the fault,

[brianmartin_2001]

Night Owl Host is live now .

No update on vd-view as yet . I suspect Simon is on holiday or something
and it has fallen over. Js-nightowl is the web link to use for now.
Lucky to have two of these.

cheers
Brian

[brianmartin_2001]

Night Owl is up for a while till about 11pm.

Not much traffic (none in 4 days)recently so hours will likely much reduce.
Not an unusual thing for a BBS of course but not much point in
burning leccy when not much activity.

Will keep you all posted.
thanks

[paulb]

So, since Brian had mentioned that he hadn't had any traffic to the BBS for a few days, I thought that tonight might be the night to check it out. I'll admit that I was a bit apprehensive about the technicalities of connecting, given previous discussions, but it all worked astonishingly well. That isn't a comment on the way the BBS is provided but the way I was connecting, but more on that shortly.

Upon logging in, I may or may not have provided my full details as guest, mentioned in an earlier post, but pressed Return and seemed to get asked for my last name and a password, followed by some other details. I then got the welcome screen but was a bit baffled about what to do next. I never used Prestel back in the day, and reading up about it more recently is like peering back into another world. Fortunately, pressing Return again brought up the main screen/menu.

I managed to navigate around by pressing the keys indicated next to various topics, then pressing Return to navigate through sequences of screens. I read the history of the endeavour along with some other content, but found myself wanting to go back to the main screen and not knowing how to. The terminal software indicated that *800 followed by Return might work, but it didn't. Either Brian saw me flailing and put up the help screen or the software does that after a while, or if it keeps getting unrecognised page requests. That introduced me to the essential commands *MAIN, *HELP, and *90 or *BYE. I had previously seen *HELP written on the main screen but thought it was just another Acorn reference rather than an actual Prestel command.

I rounded off the visit with a quick chat with Brian and promised to update this thread about my experience. Now for the unusual elements...

The welcome screen in the Jafa Mode 7 Simulator ROM's terminal emulator.

First of all, being an Electron devotee, I was using the Jafa Mode 7 Simulator ROM, meaning that my experience was somewhat different to the average Viewdata experience. After enabling the ROM using *MODE7ON, the terminal emulator can be started with *MCOMM. This is a ready-to-go Prestel terminal, apparently, and I can imagine that this would have been invaluable to Electron online service users back in the day.

An example of a screen with text and block graphics.

Although the simulator uses mode 2 and therefore requires the kind of low-resolution 40-column font that is familiar from various games, the text is still readable if somewhat challenging on the eyes for larger volumes. Some characters are difficult to represent, like # losing one of the vertical strokes. Interestingly, the terminal maps Return to # by default, apparently to make the experience more fluid, and maybe that is a common Prestel terminal feature on computers, as opposed to dedicated terminals.

The *HELP screen showing a larger volume of text.

Previous discussions have been had about the readability of the SAA5050's font, seemingly justifying the additional complexity in the Beeb's circuitry, and I can imagine revisiting the BBS with the Pace Commstar software (Electron version, known as Tellstar in publicity), which would provide a monochrome genuine 40-column experience, or with one of the mode 7 adapters for the "true" Viewdata experience. But that leads me to the twist in the tale...

I actually managed to connect to the BBS using Elkulator via a telnet relay, as opposed to any real hardware. So, any mode 7 adapter would be an emulation, which would provide a more Beeb-like experience. However, we've all seen Beeb-style Viewdata many times already, so it is nice to take a look at something different.

The astonishing aspect of all of this is that it relies on the serial cartridge emulation I added to Elkulator just over a year ago. I've given this emulation some exercise and written some software to use it, but I haven't been completely certain that it does the right things. I was actually rather wary of plumbing this up to a telnet connection, and I was also uncertain as to whether telnet was being used here, but the connection was made and all the data went there and back without any obvious difficulties.

Maybe this must be one of the more unusual clients that has visited the BBS, but it suggests that anyone with an Electron, Plus 1, serial cartridge, Mode 7 Simulator ROM, and modem would be quite able to visit, too. Without all of that, I'll add the telnet relay program to the Elkulator repositories so that it can provide something of a substitute.

Thanks to Brian for entertaining my visit!

[brianmartin_2001]

Many thanks for that generous write up Paul.
Was great to talk to you last night , and then hear about how
you connected. You are the first (Electron?) user to connect
I think .. Now that you've verified a concrete method (emulator or otherwise)
it would be great to have more Elk devotees visit the Board or for that matter
anyone lol.

I am still hoping Marrold will log on from his VTX5000 and Speccy at
some point soon. There is a nice fella Rick who may attempt to connect
with a C64 and new WiModem soon hopefully.

Was so interesting to see the screenshots of how the Mode7 simulator
delivered a Mode7 style display. It renders that bit differently but still has
it's own feel. Thanks for educating me and your efforts to document it.

Night Owl is now up for calls.

Brian

[paulb]

Was so interesting to see the screenshots of how the Mode7 simulator delivered a Mode7 style display. It renders that bit differently but still has it's own feel. Thanks for educating me and your efforts to document it.

It was a pleasure to log in and explore! Here are some screenshots from tonight's session using Commstar:

The welcome screen in Commstar on the Electron.

The lack of colour isn't a deal-breaker, but it does require a bit more attention from the user about the navigational clues on each screen. I would think that in the early days of Prestel, designing for monochrome screens might have been paramount, catering to low-cost terminals as well as more exotic products like the STC Executel.

The main screen/menu in Commstar.

Oddly, Commstar seems to use mode 4 as opposed to mode 6, leaving plenty of blank lines available. Obviously, the native font in a 40-column mode is more readable than the narrow font used by Jafa's ROM, but mode 6 line spacing would have helped, even if the graphics might be disrupted somewhat.

The telesoftware screen showing a fair amount of text.

I think that using mode 1 would have at least given the benefit of some colour, although applying the colours sensibly might be a challenge. Having eight simulated colours is possible in a four-colour mode but involves other compromises. Maybe the Prestel designers considered semantic display properties, similar to other presentation and publishing technologies.

The colours in pictures are not usually adorned with any particular meaning, being what they are to the artist and the viewer. Commstar evidently doesn't try to introduce dithering in place of colours, which might be problematic either way. However, some pictures work well regardless...

The leaving screen in Commstar.

I think the leaving screen holds up in monochrome due to the silhouette, giving it even more of a night-time mood! Here's the colour version:

The leaving screen in Jafa's Mode 7 Simulator terminal.

Brian and I had the occasion to chat about many matters, including all the great work being done with Electron hardware these days. One topic pertained to mode 7 emulation and how Commstar manages on the Electron. I was reminded about the following Electron User articles, one that covered a more general emulator, and the piece about Commstar when it was introduced as part of the Tellstar package:

"Go Mode 7 the software way", Electron User, January 1987.
"Electron shall speak unto Electron...", Electron User, February 1986. (See also the Morley Electron Teletext Adapter advert on the facing page.)

There must be someone out there with a serial-equipped Electron, or maybe one of the satisfied Elk WiFi users, for whom the BBS must be well within reach of their capabilities. A visit report from a "real hardware" user would be a worthwhile read.

Thanks once again to Brian for the hospitality!

[brianmartin_2001]

Excellent craic last night Paul .

Amazing to see those screen shots from the Elkulator Commstar
monochrome display. A silent movie version of Night Owl
It does have a charm of it's own I can see.

The BBS is up now for those interested.
I am hoping I can revive my Pi-Bridge after screwing up
the install today, if I wasn't so caught up with that the Host would have
been up earlier. Still hoping I can join the Econet LAN party tomorrow.

Brian

oh and just thought I'd mention.
Night Owl now has a page on the IPTIA BBS Resource website.

https://www.ipingthereforeiam.com/bbs/? ... l&id=22630

[paulb]

Excellent craic last night Paul .

Indeed.

Amazing to see those screen shots from the Elkulator Commstar
monochrome display. A silent movie version of Night Owl
It does have a charm of it's own I can see.

It would have been nice back in the day to have terminals doing VDU code interpretation and allowing simple graphics as opposed to mode 7. Maybe people were actually doing that. I looked into such things a while ago, albeit in the context of programs running on a Linux/Unix host generating the codes.

I've tried to tidy up my Elkulator tool for connecting via telnet, and for now it lives on a branch in my clone of the Stardot repository:

uiopaubo/elkulator at serial-relay

Specifically, it is this file which should work with Elkulator from the Stardot repository. I'll probably submit a pull request and get it merged into the Stardot repository itself.

And I'll aim to look into logging in again soon, although maybe not tonight. I want to let other people have a go!