Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

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thecellartroll
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Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

Thanks to Spanners who brought me some boxes of intrigue today I now have a Bush internet.tv sitting on my desk with its top off. It is an intriguing beasty which it looks like several people have performed various modifications to get a RISC OS desktop and then usually they abandon them to a dusty cupboard.

Since the mods look to be within (kinda) my abilities it seems like a fun thing to do. I don't yet have a parallel ZIP100 drive so no desktop for me but I have done some poking and investigating this evening.

Here is the little mainboard. It is very small. Can't remember how big the A7000 mainboard is but I think it is much bigger than this! There are a lot of pins on the ARM SOC that are not connected to anything.
a6000 mainboard.jpg

It has RISC OS-NC (Network Computer presumably) ROM chips. Ian Jeffray says that nothing happens if you plug RO3.7 ROMs in. I also read that somewhere else that I can't find now. The person thought that might be due to the total lack of CMOS RAM circuitry, but I think that may not be true as I think most RISC OS machines drop to the supervisor prompt anyway if the CMOS RAM chip is missing. Though perhaps it is because the RO3.7 ROMS don't have the module to switch the SCART socket on.
a6000 ROM chips.jpg

Here is the IO chip that cunning bodgery may need to speak to:
a6000 IO chip.jpg

To the right of the ROM chips is a solder point for a mysterious and quite big connector that seems to be routed to the ROM chips. No idea what this can be for.
a6000 mystery connector.jpg

The modem, which is part of the mainboard seems to appear to RISC OS as a podule. It has an accompanying MODEM module. This is not in the main ROM chips, but lives in this little PROM. I confirmed this by removing the PROM which made the module disappear. Perhaps, since the modem is essentially useless, an alternative module or two could be loaded here for improved functionality at power on? I haven't seen anyone investigate that.
A6000 modem eprom chip.jpg

Then finally this looks like the area where the sound components should be added. With SK1 below, which I assume is where a PS2 connector can be fitted.
a6000 sound circuit and sk1.jpg

Now off to stalk ebay for a reasonably priced Zip100 drive, which hopefully hasn't already click-of-deathed.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by IanJeffray »

thecellartroll wrote: Thu Oct 20, 2022 10:16 pm I think that may not be true as I think most RISC OS machines drop to the supervisor prompt anyway if the CMOS RAM chip is missing.
I'd say that's not correct. "Most" RISC OS versions just go ga-ga without CMOS RAM - chiefly due to lack of configuration to determine which modules are inserted. Sometimes with RISC OS 3.1 you can get a "short" module list and a (non-functional) * prompt.

It would be easy enough to tack on a CMOS RAM chip though - all you need is 5v, GND and the two I2C lines connected to the SoC - see if you can find anywhere the I2C is tracked out of the SoC for easier poking?
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

IanJeffray wrote: Thu Oct 20, 2022 10:30 pm It would be easy enough to tack on a CMOS RAM chip though - all you need is 5v, GND and the two I2C lines connected to the SoC - see if you can find anywhere the I2C is tracked out of the SoC for easier poking?
The two I2C lines, if they exist, must be called something else as I can't find them on the pinout for the CL-PS7500FE. On the pinout for the IOMD on RPC they're called IICC and IICD and on the schematic I2cc and I2cd. If only a schematic existed for the A7000+!
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

Ah, my investigations found this:
Two open drain pins which (unlike the IOP[7:0] bus) cannot be used to generate interrupts, but can be used as general purpose I/O pins, for example to communicate with a real time clock chip
So I think that the CMOS RAM chip would connect to OD0 and OD1. Both of those pins are connected to vias nearby which could be soldered to.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by IanJeffray »

thecellartroll wrote: Thu Oct 20, 2022 11:41 pm Both of those pins are connected to vias nearby which could be soldered to.
There must be some i2c device on the board - likely with handier chunkier places to solder to -- and it'd be interesting to find out what, since there are no other devices on the i2c bus on any other Acorn machine.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by BeebMaster »

It looks to be a completely different design to my own Acorn Network Computer, but running the same variant of RISC OS-NC:

Image

I got into the Supervisor prompt, and the Desktop of sorts, by removing the Ethernet podule and then pressing ESCAPE a lot:

https://www.beebmaster.co.uk/32bit/UseNC.html
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

IanJeffray wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 12:07 am There must be some i2c device on the board - likely with handier chunkier places to solder to -- and it'd be interesting to find out what, since there are no other devices on the i2c bus on any other Acorn machine.
The board is out of the case!

They go to this little ATMEL026, which I'm guessing is where settings for the ISP are stored.
a6000 ATMEL026.jpg
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

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BeebMaster wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 12:19 am It looks to be a completely different design to my own Acorn Network Computer, but running the same variant of RISC OS-NC:
That's huge! And looks a lot less "cost reduced." I think now I know what the mystery connector on the internet.tv is though; it looks like your pcmcia connector but unpopulated.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by BeebMaster »

Could well be! I don't know what's supposed to fit there, the only thing I have ever had with a PCMCIA connector is that CD-ROM drive I tried.

It also looks like I never tried to see if it has a real-time clock.

In your pictures, I see they are named "A6000..", is that the unofficial missing number for these things?
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by IanJeffray »

BeebMaster wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 12:19 am It looks to be a completely different design to my own Acorn Network Computer
NC is quite a different beast to the Bush STB really. The NC is very much just a repackaged A7000.
Acorn's NCs even had a standard podule connector -- I have an old "NC" Ethernet card in an A5000 for example.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

BeebMaster wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 12:35 am In your pictures, I see they are named "A6000..", is that the unofficial missing number for these things?
Very unofficial. I just don't like the name Bush internet.tv :lol:
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by sweh »

thecellartroll wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 12:31 am I think now I know what the mystery connector on the internet.tv is though; it looks like your pcmcia connector but unpopulated.
Maybe it was for a potential cablecard adapter, which is common in the US for decrypting cable TV signals and is in PCMCIA format ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CableCARD )
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

I think that a good experiment would be to lift that ATMEL NVRAM chip and tack in a CMOS RAM chip and try "proper" RISC OS ROMs in it. Mainly since no-one seems to have documented trying that. It would seem to make sense that RO would flake out with totally the wrong chip connected where it is expecting to see CMOS RAM data. Do you have any spare ROMs I could borrow Ian?
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by richw »

The original NCs had a PCMCIA connector. This was to facilitate a 'smart card' slot on the front, which you used to authenticate & configure your NC. Somewhere, I have a copy of one of the versions of the smart card programming software. It typically stored your ISP dial, authentication, home page and email details. I remember programming one for Freeserve and sticking it into a NetStation.

Come to think of it, the PCMCIA hardware probably isn't a million miles away from whatever they were dreaming up for the A7000 and/or Stork.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by IanJeffray »

thecellartroll wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 12:20 pm Do you have any spare ROMs I could borrow Ian?
Probably. Or I can make you a set.

Don't see any need to lift the existing i2c chip out though - it's a device-addressed bus - each type of chip has a unique 7bit address, so you can just sling another thing on the bus.

If you have a scope or LA you could even see if RO is getting as far as trying to even talk to the CMOS RAM, before doing any soldering.

Another useful thing to do would be to find out where you could lash a POSTbox to the board.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

IanJeffray wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 6:16 pm Another useful thing to do would be to find out where you could lash a POSTbox to the board.
There is a post connector (without pins) I believe. Someone has connected a post box before :D

I do have a scope so I can certainly do some poking when I attach a CMOS RAM chip. Presumably it wont care if the crystal is missing (so I guess the clock won't run).
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by IanJeffray »

thecellartroll wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 8:01 pm I do have a scope so I can certainly do some poking when I attach a CMOS RAM chip. Presumably it wont care if the crystal is missing (so I guess the clock won't run).
The point was to do it without bothering soldering a CMOS RAM chip - just see if it's even doing reads.
But yeah, doesn't matter if you have no xtal. Do make sure to strap the address pin, though.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by IanJeffray »

thecellartroll wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 8:01 pm There is a post connector (without pins) I believe.
Looks like LK5? Has that been buzzed-out to confirm?
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

IanJeffray wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 8:04 pm Looks like LK5? Has that been buzzed-out to confirm?
And tested too:
viewtopic.php?t=19132
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

IanJeffray wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 8:03 pm Do make sure to strap the address pin, though.
I am not familiar with "strap." Does that mean the A0 pin to ground?
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by IanJeffray »

thecellartroll wrote: Sun Oct 23, 2022 10:44 pm
IanJeffray wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 8:03 pm Do make sure to strap the address pin, though.
I am not familiar with "strap." Does that mean the A0 pin to ground?
Yep.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

Further investigations of the board:
The distance between the pins on the ROM chips seems to be 2.5mm (measured without science). So I don't think that Ian's A3010 IDE board would fit into the ROM sockets as it looks like the A3010 sockets are further apart. Boo.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by baz4096 »

IanJeffray wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 5:41 pm Bet you the ROM spacing differs from A3010 though ;)

Ian already called it :D

Edit: also, aren't the ROMs swapped around on the Bush vs A3010?
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

baz4096 wrote: Mon Oct 24, 2022 1:57 pm Ian already called it :D

Edit: also, aren't the ROMs swapped around on the Bush vs A3010?
Indeed he did. More than once :D but I couldn't find whether anyone had actually measured.

Swapped round ROMs is not something I had even considered! How the heck to check that... *edit - looks like you are correct. When compared to the Pin1 location of the ROM chips they are the opposite way round. Baws.
Last edited by thecellartroll on Mon Oct 24, 2022 2:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by baz4096 »

thecellartroll wrote: Mon Oct 24, 2022 2:15 pm How the heck to check that...

Looking at your pictures, with the roms oriented so that pin 1 is upwards, there's 2208,671-11 on the left, and 2208,670-11 on the right. I'd have to check the contents to be sure, but would it be safe to assume the lower numbered IC is ROM1, the higher is ROM2, (so ROM2 left, ROM1 right)?

On the A3010, ROM1 (0296,061-02) is on the left, ROM2 (0296,062-02) on the right.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

You replied faster than I edited!

So that's an issue, but then there are lots of nice solder points on the adjacent PCMCIA header that would allow the fly leads (probably use a ribbon cable?) to be soldered instead as those are routed straight to the ROM sockets.
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by baz4096 »

Now that would be handy, if all the pins you need are conveniently on that unpopulated connector...
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by thecellartroll »

baz4096 wrote: Mon Oct 24, 2022 2:46 pm Now that would be handy, if all the pins you need are conveniently on that unpopulated connector...
I can confirm that they are!
pcmcia connector pins.jpg
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by IanJeffray »

thecellartroll wrote: Mon Oct 24, 2022 4:53 pm I can confirm that they are!
Now to see where all the original flying wires would connect to... BD0..BD7, ~I!3, ~B!, ~RBen, ~WBl, ~WBe
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Re: Another Bush internet.tv mod thread

Post by baz4096 »

thecellartroll wrote: Mon Oct 24, 2022 4:53 pm
baz4096 wrote: Mon Oct 24, 2022 2:46 pm Now that would be handy, if all the pins you need are conveniently on that unpopulated connector...
I can confirm that they are!
pcmcia connector pins.jpg
IanJeffray wrote: Mon Oct 24, 2022 5:00 pm Now to see where all the original flying wires would connect to... BD0..BD7, ~I!3, ~B!, ~RBen, ~WBl, ~WBe
I was just about to say there's still 12 or so flying leads to hook up...
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