Econet for dummies

[jubber]

I've got a few Acorns linked up on an econet (using the pi-bridge) and I've even found the software that lets you set the number of the machine, so it doesn't give you an error on bootup. So there's a file repository and I can drop and grab files from it on different machines. All excellent so far.

What I'm not sure how to do is to see what other machines are on the econet - or log in using anything other than I AM SYST. I don't know how users who aren't SYST can see the econet. I AM BARRY does not work. I am actually not Barry. Perhaps the econet can tell.

I had a brief look at the advanced econet user guide, but it was in fact advanced. I need the dimwitted econet user guide.

Update: I've found some software on APDL - !Machines lets you see the other machines on the internet, !Notify allows you to send messages. Those were on B634, on APDL. Is there any other software I should try out?

[jgharston]

You need to create users on the server, using whatever tools the server you are using uses for creating users.

To make this easier, I modified SJ's EditPass for the MDFS to create versions for Acorn's Level 2 and Level 3/FileStore servers: link

To see what other users are logged on, there is a standard library utility *USERS.
To see what other machines are plugged into the network, there is a standard library utilities *STATIONS
Both of them are in my standard network utilities pack: https://mdfs.net/Apps/Networking/NetUtilB.zip
and also included in my standard full network library: https://mdfs.net/Apps/Networking/NetLibB.zip

[jubber]

Hi - a huge amount of files in there. When I hit F12 and try to run *Stations it gives me "No run action specified for this file type" - is this for 32-bit acorns?

The docs have [0D] in them everywhere - perhaps I'm using the wrong machine.

[philpem]

Hi - a huge amount of files in there. When I hit F12 and try to run *Stations it gives me "No run action specified for this file type" - is this for 32-bit acorns?

The docs have [0D] in them everywhere - perhaps I'm using the wrong machine.

Looking at the next level up -- https://mdfs.net/Apps/Networking/ -- it seems you need the NetLibA and/or NetUtilA ZIP files for RISC OS.

[KenLowe]

What I'm not sure how to do is to see what other machines are on the econet - or log in using anything other than I AM SYST. I don't know how users who aren't SYST can see the econet. I AM BARRY does not work. I am actually not Barry. Perhaps the econet can tell.

Log onto your Pi Bridge as a Privileged user (eg log in as SYST). To create new users use the *NEWUSER <username> command.

Full details of Privileged and non-Privileged commands are available in the user guide:

https://github.com/cr12925/PiEconetBrid ... ADME#L1255

There's a library command that lists the machines that are logged into the file server. Let me see if I can find the details...

Edit: *USERS: viewtopic.php?p=344926#p344926

[jgharston]

Hi - a huge amount of files in there. When I hit F12 and try to run *Stations it gives me "No run action specified for this file type" - is this for 32-bit acorns?

The docs have [0D] in them everywhere - perhaps I'm using the wrong machine.

You're using the wrong text editor. Wot? You don't have StrongEd or Zap?

Ctrl-f8 in Edit swaps CR/LF line endings.

Looking at the next level up -- https://mdfs.net/Apps/Networking/ -- it seems you need the NetLibA and/or NetUtilA ZIP files for RISC OS.

Yep, xxxA are ARM stuff, xxxB are BBC stuff. I hadn't noticed you were wanting RISC OS utils.

[IanJeffray]

I hadn't noticed you were wanting RISC OS utils.

This is the 32bit section of the forum...

[BeebMaster]

Acorn file servers (and the Pi Bridge replicates the same function) will only allow logon of users which exist, so they must have been created on the file server by the network manager (ie. self - as everyone with an Econet is the network manager nowadays!). SJ Research servers can have a default user which will be used to log on if the user ID given doesn't exist.

Often the BOOT user (*I AM BOOT, also selected with SHIFT-BREAK (but not as straightforward with RISC OS machines compared to 8 bit machines)) was used to present a menu to users, allowing commonly used facilities to be easy accessible, or to then allow the user to log on under their own name.

One of the great benefits of Econet is the ability to have many different users to provide specific functions. There's no need to have a single user per individual and stick everything related to that person in there, which is what would have happened in the Econets of old. So I have *I AM ROMS which takes me to my ROMs directory, *I AM ANFS which loads ANFS into a BBC B, *I AM BASIC4 which loads BASIC IV into the second processor of a BBC B, *I AM INTERWORD, which loads and then starts that word-processor, *I AM SPOOL which puts me in my NFS shared directory for spooling BASIC listings.

These of course are all 8-bit related things, but I do have users for some of my later Acorns, eg. *I AM A305, *I AM A440/1 etc which put me in the location I have for stuff related to those machines.

[jubber]

Thanks for the info Phil - and BeebMaster.

Ken pointed me in the right direction. There's a command *NEWUSER which does what I want - so I can type *NEWUSER A3010 and I AM A3010 - and lo, A3010 has its own directory. Which is nice. Unfortunately *PRIV does nothing (actually, it returns "bad command", which is odd - it's not showing "file not found") so I can't make A3010 a system user. But still, that's a minor concern.

[IanJeffray]

Unfortunately *PRIV does nothing (actually, it returns "bad command", which is odd - it's not showing "file not found") so I can't make A3010 a system user. But still, that's a minor concern.

"Bad command" would be issued if you had the parameters wrong.

Code: Select all

*PRIV Ian S

works fine for me, for example.

RTFM? https://github.com/cr12925/PiEconetBrid ... /v2.0/docs (commands are at the bottom)

[jubber]

The manual is where I found the priv command!

*I AM A3010
*PRIV A3010 S
File 'PRIV' not found

Waitaminute...

So I need to do
*NEWUSER Colin
*I AM SYST
*PRIV Colin S
*I AM Colin

Because (d'oh) only SYST can issue privilege status commands. Thinking about it - that of course makes sense. This was for teachers and unruly pupils.

[BeebMaster]

This might be a bit of a bug in the PiFS.

*PRIV should never say "File not found" or "Bad command".

On its own without a parameter, it should say User not known when issued by a system privileged user, or Insufficient privilege if issued by a non-priv user.

With a user ID which doesn't exist, it should again say User not known, and if an incorrect parameter is given after the user ID, it should say Bad privilege letter.

Incidentally, there is nothing special about the SYST user other than it is generally created with system privilege when setting up a file server. More than one user can have system privilege, and the SYST user doesn't need to exist necessarily, nor does it even have to have system privilege. Only system privileged users can use privileged commands or operations (there aren't all that many (creating and removing users, adding and removing privilege, allocating user free space and setting the file server time is about it); most of the time the inability to do things results from lack of access permissions rather than system privilege), it isn't the user SYST per se which is required.

[KenLowe]

The manual is where I found the priv command!

*I AM A3010
*PRIV A3010 S
File 'PRIV' not found

Waitaminute...

So I need to do
*NEWUSER Colin
*I AM SYST
*PRIV Colin S
*I AM Colin

Because (d'oh) only SYST can issue privilege status commands. Thinking about it - that of course makes sense. This was for teachers and unruly pupils.

...and once you have given Colin System privileges (by *PRIV Colin S), if you then log in as Colin, Colin should then be able to run privileged commands too.

[KenLowe]

This might be a bit of a bug in the PiFS.

*PRIV should never say "File not found" or "Bad command".

These privileged commands are not available to non system users, so I think it's perfectly appropriate to state 'File not found' if a non system user tries to run that command.

[BeebMaster]

No, it isn't, because it is a file server command, so it should always be processed by the file server, and not passed to the library if the particular user isn't allowed to use it. What I said above is the standard behaviour on L3 and L4 file servers.

[davehill]

I hadn't noticed you were wanting RISC OS utils.

This is the 32bit section of the forum...

I have sometimes wondered why there isn't a dedicated Econet section, with it crossing both 8Bit and 32Bit. I get confused on where to post

[vprevel]

Hi,

I am based in Germany , and although I am primarily into HP Series 80 computers, I also have a Master 128 and a BBC model B (original owner from my University days at UKC).

Neither has Econet h/w.

I am interested in the PiEconetBridge for the RPi and the Econet h/w for my 2 BBC computers.

Can anybody point me to a source that can supply me with the parts and be willing to ship to Germany.

Thanks

Vassilis
www.series80.org

[KenLowe]

Hi,

I am based in Germany , and although I am primarily into HP Series 80 computers, I also have a Master 128 and a BBC model B (original owner from my University days at UKC).

Neither has Econet h/w.

I am interested in the PiEconetBridge for the RPi and the Econet h/w for my 2 BBC computers.

Can anybody point me to a source that can supply me with the parts and be willing to ship to Germany.

Thanks

Vassilis
www.series80.org

I can help you with that. I'll drop you a PM shortly...